PC Pals Forum
Technical Help & Discussion => Self Building, Upgrading & General Hardware Help => Topic started by: Flanjeuk on October 20, 2004, 17:06
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OK... I'm only 16 but I'm going to build a PC after christmas, I want to use it mainly for Gaming and Browsing the Internet;
I want the spec as follows:
Processor AMD 64 3000+: £112
1024 DDR400 RAM: £103
Motherboard: £80
Case: £25
Monitor: £80
Hard drive 80GB: £35
CD RW/DVD Combo: £30
Keyboard And Mouse: £15
Graphics Card later on... (Birthday February)
Total Cost: £480
All my prices are taken from Ebuyer.com
Do you have any suggestions on changes?
Thanks in advance,
John
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Flanjeuk hi and welcome to Pals ;D
Building Pcs is all about opinions and where to look for the best bargains etc etc, I have just built a pc this last month with parts mainly from ebuyer ;)and am well pleased with it.
Im sure one of the techies will be along shortly to advise and to give you the best advice possible ;)
Hookstar
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Hi Flanjeuk, and (https://www.pc-pals.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apax34.dsl.pipex.com%2Fsmileys%2Fwelcome.gif&hash=05644ab4fbfa7c9585f756e9a79aab0a53d0e346)
By the prices, it looks to be a fairly high spec machine. Would you care to tell us which Motherboard, Monitor and CD/DVD-RW you have chosen? If you want this mainly for gaming, you will obviously need a good graphics card, and I would recommend the GeForce cards over the ATI ones, but that's a personal preference.
As Hook said, one of our techies will be along this evening, and may be able to advise you better. In the meantime, check out the rest of the forum - it's fun! ;)
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Well....
Thing is I'm not sure what mobo I want/need I was hoping to find that out here...
CD RW/DVD Drive: maybe~ Samsung 52x32x52x16x Int IDE Combo OEM Black http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=60855 (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=60855) - I don't really NEED a DVD/RW as I'm trying to keep cost's as low as possible!
Monitor: just your average CRT 17"
And as for graphics I was thinking: XFX GeForce 6800 GT 256MB (but later on, at first I will make do with on board graphics until I have the money...)
~Just so you know, I can't really go over £500!~
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One other thing, is there much difference between DDR400 and DDR333?
Is it worth the extra money for 400?
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For a few more quid (£15/£20) you might as well get an DVD RW as it will give you an extra option to burn DVDs as well as write CDs as well as play DVDs.
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Well, I'm no expert on motherboards (or anything else, come to that!), but I recently built a PC for a friend, and used an Asus A7N8X-X (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=49061), which seems good value, or if you want a few more extras, perhaps the Asus A7N8X-E Deluxe (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?rb=2500406490&action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=58198)? I'm not sure you need to spend a fortune on a Motherboard, especially if you are going to add a stand alone graphics card, but that's just my opinion. Members here have built PCs on far cheaper Motherboards than the ones I have linked to.
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I put £80 because I'm willing to pay up to that...
I wasnt sure i how much a mobo would be because of the specifications I want, like the DDR400 RAM and the 64bit processor.
Also, how does Windows XP run on the 64bit processors? Do i need any thing special to make it work?
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Depends on the socket of Athlon 64 you want - currently theres a bit of a transistion phase with the pin layout of the higher end athlons.
Cheap and cheerful motherboard is about £45 for the processor you mentioned (The "Newcastle" 3200).
Worth going for the DVD writer instead of the CD Writer/combo as you *WILL* want to write some stuff out thats more than about 700Meg at some point :) . Given that the price of DVD-R is now down to about 24p a disc while CDR are at about 17p it's worth looking at something that can give you 4 times the storage capacity for only 7p more.
You don't need to do anything to Windows XP to let it run on a 64bit chip *BUT* it will only be running in 32 bit mode unless you install the Windows XP 64 version.
Also worth looking around for a second hand monitor - as more people are going towards TFTs the second hand price of CRTs has plummeted - price around here is about £25 to £35 for a good 17".
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OK then, thanks a lot everyone.
I looked on ebay, and there are come good 17" CRT monitors for around £30 (plus £15 P&P) I'll get one off there, and i found a mobo that does everything I should need (I also want on board 5.1 surround) Abit KV8 SKT 754 K8T800 SATA Gig LAN ATX Raid Sound OTES (£63) - It supports 64bit AMD Processors and DDR400 RAM, and has onboard 6 channel sound - http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=63172
Thanks again, I will update you all closer to the time... till then bye!
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OK, sorry I keep going on...
I have decided what I'm *likely* to be getting:
Processor AMD64 3000+ And Coolermaster CK8-8JD2B-0L AMD64 Cooler: £120
OCZ Premier 512MB DDR400 PC3200 RAM: £65
Abit KV8 SKT 754 K8T800 Motherboard: £65
Deluxworld M7612 Case (Matching Keyboard/Mouse/Speakers): £27
Monitor (second hand): £50max
Seagate Barracuda 80Gb 7200rpm UDMA100: £40
Samsung 52x32x52x16x Int IDE CD-RW/DVD Combo OEM Black: £30
Do you see any problems with any of that?
Thank you all!!
John.
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Hi Flanjeuk,
Take it from me if you want a good CRT monitor, you can do no better than buy a Sony "Triniton" tubed CRT,they are the flatscreen variety.
Not to be confused with the inferior CRT "shadow mask" flat screen monitors [curved tubed set behind a flat front screen and a massive mask around the screen edges] . They [Trinitons] where made for business users, but as most business users requiring 17" models are going over to TFT's Trinition/ Diamondtron monitors are only being produced new in 19" and above models.
I myself run a three 17" monitor setup for work purposes, I stare at those screens all day. So I need the sharpest brightest images, coupled with sharp text, hence I run Dell badged Trinitons.
And I can recommend the linked monitor as I have purchased one, they are Sony Triniton tubed monitors badged for Dell. The product is first class and the seller is straight as a die,you can buy with confidence. The blurb say's they are 2000 models, but mine is a 2001 model.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3695&item=5132390935&rd=1 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3695&item=5132390935&rd=1)
The product is used, and may need the casing wiping over with a cream cleaner, then it will look like new. The screens are un marked, but if one slips through pre post inspection with a scratch on it, the seller will arrange for next day pick up and exchange at no extra expense to you.
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Thanks a lot for that, I might put a bid in for that tomorrow!
I know it's two months until xmas, but I'm still really excited about getting the PC.
Not only because it's a new PC, but it will be the first I have built!
Any tips for first time builder's that I should be thinking about?
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Any tips for first time builder's that I should be thinking about?
Be prepared for it to go wrong! ;D That's all part of the fun, and it's the way you learn how to fix things. Ask Tony. ;)
Oh, and don't put a bid in for that monitor tomorrow. Wait until much nearer the end of the auction, or you could increase the bids unneccessarily. If it was me, I would wait till the last few seconds and snipe it! (https://www.pc-pals.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apax34.dsl.pipex.com%2Fsmileys%2Fevil4.gif&hash=f6c0312f1e3de1f526b8a6918e80a6e58a99cb27)
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Be prepared for a lot of shouting :)
When I build a machine I tend to do the following:
1. Check the case for any sharp edges as you will find the cheaper ones tend to cut your hands to shreds. Empty out the panels that you do not use for CD writer, floppy and motherboard backplate.
2. Insert the motherboard panel into the case - this is so the motherboard components will all be sticking out of the correct holes.
3. Insert the memory, processor and fan into the motherboard. Make sure motherboard CMOS jumper in correct place.
4. Look for the mounting points in the case and put the correct ones in for the motherboard.
5. Connect up the cables for reset, power, front audio/usb etc. from the case to the motherboard.
6. Insert CD writer, floppy and hard drive into appropriate places in the case. Connect the data cables and power up to them. Make sure jumpers on back of devices are set correctly (either Cable select or Master/Slave as appriopriate). Also ensure the cables will fit bvetween the devices and where the motherboard is finally going to be.
7. Insert motherboard into computer and attach data cables and power.
8. Insert graphics card if appropriate.
9. Power up test before closing case. Should make a satisfying 'Beep'.
10. Set CMOS correctly (date/time etc.)
11. Install operating system.
12. Do all the operating system updates.
No real problems - just make sure that you get rid of any static electricity before handling the components.
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I stare at those screens all day. So I need the sharpest brightest images, coupled with sharp text, hence I run Dell badged Trinitons.
The main reason is that hes an old fart and is too tight to get a decent pair of glasses so that he can see an ordinary screen ;D ;D ;D
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Thanks for that Dack, I feel a bit more confident now!
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Thanks a lot Tony, I just won that Monitor on eBay, got it for £21 (+£12 P&P) Great deal, hope it's worth it ;)
That's one less thing I have to worry about now! :D
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Well as Tony says " Its cheaper than paying for an optician" ;D ;D ;D
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Well as Tony says " Its cheaper than paying for an optician" ;D ;D ;D
:bitch: ;D ;)
Well done Flanje,
I'll tell you this I bought a brand new CTX 17" Shadow Mask supposebly flat screen CRT Executive Model. It was not as good as my 6 year old Dell Trinitons. So I sent it back and bought one of those you have just won. The sellers name is Damian, you'll have no problems there, just look at his feed back he has sold loads of that model of monitor.
Before I bought mine I actually emailed one guy who had been back three times to buy three of them. He turned out to be an ex TV engineer, so he knows a good monitor when he see's one, you will not be disappointed
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Just thought I'd mention that the heatsink on the Athlon64 is quite a beast on initial viewing - just take your time in working out how it actually locks into place and you'll find it's very easy :)
BTW a good place to pick up graphics cards at a reasonable price is:
http://www.lowestonweb.com/Products/ProductList.asp?e=52E363C7-D0F7-4642-9DA2-0B185DE1E835 (http://www.lowestonweb.com/Products/ProductList.asp?e=52E363C7-D0F7-4642-9DA2-0B185DE1E835)
And for 16 shouldn't you be in bed by this time :)
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::) This website seems to have everything cheaper than Ebuyer, do you think I should get it all from there instead?
Or is the website only good for graphics cards?
Thanks for the advice on the heatsink!
One more little question:
I've been looking at loads of cases, how do I know if my mobo will fit, and does the power supply make any difference - they all seem to be 300W or 350W?
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Well as Tony says " Its cheaper than paying for an optician" ;D ;D ;D
:bitch: ;D ;)
Well done Flanje,
I'll tell you this I bought a brand new CTX 17" Shadow Mask supposebly flat screen CRT Executive Model. It was not as good as my 6 year old Dell Trinitons. So I sent it back and bought one of those you have just won. The sellers name is Damian, you'll have no problems there, just look at his feed back he has sold loads of that model of monitor.
Before I bought mine I actually emailed one guy who had been back three times to buy three of them. He turned out to be an ex TV engineer, so he knows a good monitor when he see's one, you will not be disappointed
Commision ;D
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Hooky My Boy,
you know we are all here to help if we can.......or take the p**s......
Flanje, well he appealed to my better nature, him being so young and all.
Now as for the Pendle Witch ;D ;)
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I just read somthing about the different Socket types on the AMD64 Processors, so i decided I will get the AMD64 3000+ 939 Socket version
Because it is supposed to be better, and all the newer AMD64 processors use it, so i will be able to easily upgrade, without replacing the mobo, I found this one which suites my needs, there is nothing else that does everything this does for the same money:
MSI MS-7025 K8N Neo2 Platinum Motherboard: £80
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::) This website seems to have everything cheaper than Ebuyer, do you think I should get it all from there instead?
Or is the website only good for graphics cards?
Thanks for the advice on the heatsink!
One more little question:
I've been looking at loads of cases, how do I know if my mobo will fit, and does the power supply make any difference - they all seem to be 300W or 350W?
Lowestonweb are better known as Evesham micros - some things good, some bad. Another place usually worth looking at is:
www.komplett.co.uk (http://www.komplett.co.uk) - their upgrade kits could save you a bit e.g. the Athlon 64 @ 3200, 512 Ram, Motherboard and heatsink would be £287 plus postage, you'd need the Drives, case, graphics card, Keyboard and mouse, and CD/DVD drive to complete the system though.
What I usually do when building a machine is put a spreadsheet up of all the components I want and then put the costs for each supplier I intend looking at - including their postage charges as that can make a heck of a difference. I then populate it with all the parts and try and minimise the cost.
If you are looking at spending £400-£500 you should be able to get an Athlon 64 @3000 system with good graphics card very easily.
As to the socket Athlons 64s use there are 3 types 754, 939 and 940 - 754 is going to be lower end (and the Ebuyer one you specified earlier was 754) while the 939 seems to be the way the high end will progress. 940 would seem to be pretty much dead at the moment.
http://www.explosivelabs.com/reviews/s754roundup/ (http://www.explosivelabs.com/reviews/s754roundup/)
will give you a bit of a heads up as to the differences.
Not sure how much of a premium those extra pins will add - some manufacturers are now shipping an upgradable board that will handle both 754 and 939 processors.
e.g. http://www.asrock.com/product/product_K8Upgrade-760GX.htm (http://www.asrock.com/product/product_K8Upgrade-760GX.htm)
As to the power supply/case issue - usual rule is get the case with the biggest power supply you can (I usually get 350-400W these days). All normal motherboards should fit your case (unless either of them are small form factor). All that differs is the mounting points and the layout of the connectors at the back of the case.
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While out shopping today I came across a bit of an appropriate bargain in Staples.
Athlon 64 @3200
512 Ram
DVD Writer
200G hard drive
Geforce 5500 Graphics card 128M
XP Home
Few bits of software
Make is Acer and cost is £549 for the base unit. HOWEVER IIRC you get 10% discount if a student so that would make it £500 and give you full warranty. (If not a student then find a friendly one to buy it for you)
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Yeah I'm in 6th form, doing VCE ICT! So I think that makes me a student!
Thank's but.... I think that £500 is a bit steep for that set up, I cud get a smaller HDD and save some money - I only need 80GB, I already have XP Home and who know's what mobo is hidden away in there!
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I'm Back!
Finally ordered it all today:
AMD64 3500+ (Newcastle)
Corsair TwinX 1024MB (2x512DDR400)
Ebuyer Dracula Case with Side Window
80GB Barracuda HDD
MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum S939
500W PSU
etc...
Can't wait to build it!!
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Excellent news!! Let's hope your avatar doesn't change to this:- (https://www.pc-pals.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apax34.dsl.pipex.com%2Fsmileys%2Fchop-pc.gif&hash=4beee06358c0b76db098b4d385c575b0c044f20c) ;D
But seriously, let us know how you get on, and be prepared for the worst, then hopefully it won't happen. ;)
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Well, i finally finished. its all built... BUT
evrythin worked fine, i installed XP fine, and wen all that was done i restarted and it won't boot from the hard disk. i partitioned the drive and made a C: and an E: and installed XP onto the E: drive, i think that might be causing it but i dont know how to fix it because it won't boot from a CD. any help asap please
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Have you reset the boot sequence in the bios ???
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not sure wot u mean. i changed it to:
first: hard disk
second: CDROM
Third: Floppy
i didnt reset the CMOS with the jumper cos im not sure how. i just formatted it and made 1 drive, so its on the C: drive now, and evrythin went fine until i had 2 restart and it wouldnt boot from the harddisk
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If anyone can help who has msn messenger, please add me because its easier to speak over msn: hairyogurt@hotmail.com
dont ask why i chose the email.
i am stupid.
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Thats an unusual sequence, usually its floppy, hard drive then cd or floppy, cd then hard drive.
Does it say HDD 0 or HDD 1 or IDE 0 or IDE 1 when you select your hard drive in the bios or just say C ???
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As an update, I have been trying to help Flanjeuk out with this problem for the last few days on msn messenger, without any success unfortunately.
However I was talking to a friend tonight who has experienced similar problems with an MSI mobo that has SATA and IDE drives.
He found that if the BIOS was set at dsefault then it wont boot from an IDE drive.
It needs to be set up correctly in BIOS to boot properly.
I cant remember how he had his set but if you play around with disabling the SATA and other settings relating to the drives then you should get it to boot from the IDE drive
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FINALLY!!
I'm on my new PC now.
I bought a 120GB Wester Digital drive and it all works now. Cant wait for the new graphics card now!!
thanks for everybody's help!