PC Pals Forum
Technical Help & Discussion => Self Building, Upgrading & General Hardware Help => Topic started by: Simon on November 09, 2003, 11:57
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I'm thinking once again of getting a DVD Burner. I was looking at this this Sony (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=52123), which isn't the cheapest, but I think would have good build quality, and it's one of the few which are +RW and -RW compatible. The price isn't bad as well. What do you think?
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Go on Simon, :gofor: You know you want to :baad: ;D
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I've always hated the fronts of Sony Drives, why can't they make a nice flat front instead of the stupid dome one?
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I've gone for it. It was about £1 cheaper at Watford, but their delivery times are not very good lately. At least I know it will be here by Thursday. :)
All I need to do now is decide what software to use. I'll only be using it for backing up purposes, of course. (https://www.pc-pals.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apax34.dsl.pipex.com%2Fsmileys%2Fwhistle.gif&hash=9e5e71f405724cdd90e1d3316f7c93e253e58822)
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I'll be wanting those pirate copies by friday the Simon ;D
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(https://www.pc-pals.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apax34.dsl.pipex.com%2Fsmileys%2Fwhome.gif&hash=f38c163333b61f0ea4f52c23e34600474c53ad19) Not me, mate. I wouldn't copy movies, as pirating causes untold damage to the film industry. Unless, of course, it's for my own personal use. I suppose if I hired a DVD and didn't get a chance to watch it, due to unforseen circumstances, I wouldn't feel too bad about copying it to watch at a later date, but I think even that is still technically illegal. (https://www.pc-pals.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apax34.dsl.pipex.com%2Fsmileys%2Fwhistle.gif&hash=9e5e71f405724cdd90e1d3316f7c93e253e58822)
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So you won't be using it very much then, Simon. (https://www.pc-pals.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hogarth-hq.com%2Fsmileys%2Frollsmile.gif&hash=4934ee92cfb6f8f417330701e6ffb04631eb2f63)
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Well, obviously I'll need to test it fully. ;) ;D
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The main problem with making a backup copy of a DVD is that most films on a dvd are around 9 gig whereas the current size of recordable dvds are 4.7 gig max :(
I believe that you cant get around this problem by dropping the extra bits, like the subtitles and extra languages and different view angle bits, from the original dvd but this means its not as straightforward as bunging the original dvd in your dvd drive and a writeable dvd in the dvd writer and getting an exact copy a few minutes later like you can do with an audio cd :(
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Usual packages to use:
1. DVD decryptor. This will read the original disc in and strip the naughty CSS protection off it. You will of course need a LOT of space on your NTFS formatted hard drive. (Especially if you use the file option and select "all files")
2. DVD2ONE. This will take a DVD-9 disc layout and shrink it down to a DVD-5 disc that you will then be able to write out. (Another program that does the same is "Instant Copy")
3. Nero. To write the newly fitting set of files out to your DVD-R.
You could, of course, just use dvd decryptor to extract the film and leave off all the extras and that usually will fit on a disc.
Or so I am reliably informed.
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Thanks Dack, will look into those.
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Simon, put me first in the queue and I won't report you to trading standards. ;)
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:pmsl:
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well man how bout this. You iron out the details on the best progs and steps to copy a dvd that satisfies you the best and post them here. Meaning as when the drives themselves get to a reasonable enough price for my lazy self you would have finished all the grunt work on the actual copying.
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I will share any information I legally can, Bob. :)
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How stupid is this? I got my new Sony DWU-14A (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=52123) DVD+/-RW drive, went to install it, and found that the corner of the motherboard is in the way of the third external drive bay! This means that I can only have two drives (without getting a new case), so I have had to replace my perfectly working CD-RW, with the new drive. :tony:
Haven't actually tried it yet, but a program like DVD X Copy Express (http://www.dvdxcopy.com/xpress.asp) looks like it might be useful for backing up material you specifically own (i.e. home movies). Of course, we can't promote illegal copying of DVD Films (or anything else) here, so what anyone might use that program for is in no way endorsed, or associated with PC Pals Forum.
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Just purchased this one..with the 25 discs as well?
http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?
action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=49638 (http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/products/index.html?<br />action=c2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=49638)
Will let you know what I think later on in the week 8)
Hookstar
Link shrunk to fit ;)
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Hope you didn't buy the Mirror discs........They are not exactly the best quality. BTW it was about £1 cheaper at SVP/Blankdiscshop/121cdr :)
Writer is pretty good but had issues with fast extraction IIRC - think that modded firmware is available at www.rpc1.org (http://www.rpc1.org)
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Hope you didn't buy the Mirror discs........They are not exactly the best quality. BTW it was about £1 cheaper at SVP/Blankdiscshop/121cdr :)
Yep bought the mirror discs, to start with? ok to trial the new dvd with and what's £1 over £100 1% :P
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An example of the 'quality' of Mirror discs.
Friend of mine was going to send some data to me this week - had 4 attempts at writing on Mirror discs (at 4x, 2x, 1x and another 1x). None of them worked.
They tend to use the Princo dye if I'm not mistaken which is a bit :vomit: (in that they are not as compatible with DVD drives, nor-as reliable to write to as the Ritek dye).
He's since gone and bought some Maxell discs from Staples (25 pack is about £21) which are the Ritek G04 dye as a stopgap before buying some from SVP.
Just say this as it won't be a good trial of your drive if the media is no-good.
And £1 of £85 is more like 1.2% ;)
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I bought a pack of 25 Datawrite (http://www.savastore.com/include2/info7.asp?catalog%5Fname=Savastore&product%5Fid=10265015&pid=44), from Watford Electronics, for just under £20. I screwed one up myself, but other than that, no problems yet.
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And £1 of £85 is more like 1.2% ;)
Pedant! ::) ;D :lol:
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Shipping Band: £4.49
Approx Cart Weight: 1.55Kg
Shipping Surcharge: £0.00
SubTotal: £90.29
VAT: £15.81
Total: £106.10
probably a bit conservitive with my £100.. :-\ less than 1%
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Not really as SVP just had a 99p shipping weekend :)
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Being the Impatiant sod that I am.....wanted it yesterday ;D
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Being the Impatiant sod that I am.....wanted it yesterday ;D
I'm a bit like that too :P
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Ok..everything set up now?
BUT..
Top Drawer is the DVD/CD Rom
Next DVD RW
Then at the bottom is the CD RW.
The reason I want to keep them all in is that the CD RW records at 40x and the DVD/RW records at 16X so you see thats why I want to keep all of them in.
BUT.. although the start up screen reconises they are all there, the CD RW doesnt work :(
Has anybody any Ideas, racking the grey matter a bit here.
Cheers Hook
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I assume that the jumpers are set correctly for master/slave on each one ?
Does it list them all in the Device manager, without any yellow ? or ! ?
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I have seen some odd things happen with CD-ROMs and CD-Writers on the same IDE channel. It sounds as if there might nbe one of these odd conflicts occurring.
Have you tried swapping the order at all?
Also do you really need the DVD/CD-ROM? The Writers are probably fast enough for reading aren't they?
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Define "Not work" :)
I assume the Bios sees all the drives. (Which would mean power and jumper settings were correct).
Does Windows see all the drives?
Can you just not write (which can be down to the writing software). Or can you not read either?
Have you moved one of the drives over to the Primary IDE from the secondary IDE (in which case it could be a motherboard driver issue).
Simplest way to see if the device is correctly detected is to do the usual (windows Key) and (break) combination to get the system info, then Hardware and Device manager (as Sandra suggested). Have a look under IDE controllers and then at the properties on the Primary and Secondary IDE channels to see if the advanced settings have a difference in DMA modes.
I'd hazzard a guess that you'e got a UDMA66 cable on your hard drive which is now connected to one of the other devices that doesn't support UDMA66 - this causes all sorts of strange problems w.r.t. detection issues.
Solution is either drop back to 33 cable (and slow your hard drive down) or learn to love writing at 16x :) Changing the settings in the advanced settings mentioned may allow you to do a correct detect.
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DVD/CD Rom and DVD/RW on same cable as Secondry master and slave and Primary Hard drive and CC/RW on same cable as master and slave
Bios sees all the drives? but there is no mention(sight) of the cd drive in system properties/device manager.
BUT? I dont want a blank space :'( in the front panel ;D and to write at x16 :o.. doing 30 disks a night slows down a bit.
I think its a Mobo issue, but not up to speed on this one.
Hook
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I also have three drives connected. The DVD/CDROM and the CDRW are respectively Master and Slave on the Secondary connection, and the Hard Drive and the DVD Writer are repectively Master and Slave on the Primary connection. I was quite amazed that everything worked, and was 'seen' first time, as I usually get at least one of the jumpers wrong. All I had to do was change the drive letters to the correct order.
Sorry, that doesn't help you, Hook. :-\
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All I can suggest is that you try swapping the cables for the writers around, so that the CD Writer is on the same cable as the HDD and the DVD Writer is with the DVD/CD.
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Just found this on my mobo disk that came packaged with it.
In most PC's, the IDE controller allows you to connect up to two devices.
The primary device must contain the Operating System (e.g., MS-DOS) and
this is almost always a hard disk drive. This device is set to Master
mode to enable the PC to recognise it as the boot-up drive. The other
device connected to this IDE cable must be set to Slave mode.
For example, you can have a PC with a Master hard disk drive set as
drive C, and a Slave IDE CD-ROM drive set as drive D.
If this is the case with your computer, make sure that the CD-ROM drive
is configured as a Slave device.
There's only a Primary IDE controller in most PCs. Some of the newer
PCs have an additional Secondary IDE controller to support another two
devices.
The table below shows what you need to do to set the CD-ROM drive
to each of the three modes:
Mode IDE Controller Master / Slave Mode
Primary Slave Primary Slave Jumper capped
Secondary Master Secondary Master Jumper capped
Secondary Slave Secondary Slave Jumper capped
The driver will automatically locate for the Primary and Secondary
devices.
The IDE CD-ROM drive is set to Slave mode, when the Slave Jumper is
capped or none of the Master and Slave Jumpers is capped.
You should check that the CD-ROM drive is configured properly before
you connect the CD-ROM drive to the IDE connector.
If your PC's IDE connector supports only two devices, and you already
have two hard disks in your PC, remove the Slave hard disk and connect
that IDE connector to the CD-ROM drive or install a secondary IDE
controller.
Hookstar, still lost in space ;D
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Which mobo have you ?
Looking at that it appears that you have added a PCI IDE controller and disabled the onboard one somehow ???
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Hiya ;D
Ok Elite Mobo ECSK7S5A
Looking at that it appears that you have added a PCI IDE controller and disabled the onboard
Huh? ;)
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Unless you have added a PCI controller card then it somehow has detected the motherboards one incorrectly.
I would remove the PCI IDE controller from the Device Manager and then reboot and it should find and install the correct on board one.
If it doesnt and it comes up with the same thing in the Device Manager again then try running the motherboard driver CD if you have it :doggie:
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Does it list your three devices in this bit, Hook?
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Nooooooooo :'(.. what does your Ide look like
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Whats your dodgy "Other Device" in there Simon ???
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Unless you have added a PCI controller card then it somehow has detected the motherboards one incorrectly.
I would remove the PCI IDE controller from the Device Manager and then reboot and it should find and install the correct on board one.
If it doesnt and it comes up with the same thing in the Device Manager again then try running the motherboard driver CD if you have it :doggie:
But his IDE just shows the usual one IDE controller (a SIS one) and the two IDE channels (Primary and secondary) that are connected to it ???
Have you tried changing the IDE cable as I suggested (just to see if the problem goes away)?
Other ideas over at:
http://www.cdrinfo.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8915 (http://www.cdrinfo.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=8915)
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Why does it show it as a PCI one then Dack ?
I was looing at getting a controller card as an option to flashing my bios once in order to run a bigger hard drive than my pc could take and assumed it was something like that ?
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Here's my IDE list. That 'dodgy other item' is my Printer, Sandra. The drivers were unsigned, which might be why it's whingeing, but it works OK.
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Yours is similar to mine Simon, I have never seen the IDE controller come up as a PCI one before, thats why I suggested he remove it but Dack says its normal for a SIS chipset ???
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Why does it show it as a PCI one then Dack ?
I was looing at getting a controller card as an option to flashing my bios once in order to run a bigger hard drive than my pc could take and assumed it was something like that ?
It just means that it's connected to the PCI bus, nothing more.
If you change the view of the device manager to 'view devices by connection' you'll also see that it appears under the standard PC->PCI bus for your IDE controller.
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Never mind Chaps and Chappess.......I have tried everything and still no go even tho it shows in Bios but not anywhere else >:(.
Will have to record cds @16x on dvd rw, still it looks good having all the trays full up ;D
Many thanks for all the replys, if you are ever in this neck of the woods give us call and I will buy you a drink..Promise ;D
Hookstar (Terry)
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Surely you're not giving up, Hook? :o :o I had this problem with a CD drive not so long ago. I would have sworn I had everything right. The jumpers, the leads, everything. In the end I took it all to bits and started again. I still don't know what was wrong, but it then worked.
Have you double checked the jumper positions, and made certain that the middle connector on the IDE lead goes to the slave device, and all that?
Something else which might be worth a try is to 'uninstall' all the CD/DVD drives in Device Manager, then let Windows find them again. I think you said they are all present on your boot screen, so maybe it has simply failed to install the CDRW, and has got confused with the drive letters? This is only a blind guess, but I don't think it can do any harm.
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Just a thought, thanks Simon as you made me think of it ;)
Some hard drives have one jumper setting when used as a single master on a cable and a different one when set as a master with a slave, it could be that.
You will have to pull the drive out and check what it says Hooky, or look on the drive manufacturers site.
Dont just assume its same setting as it was on as a single master :)
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Sandra, one of the jumper settings is Cable Select, yes? What would happen if you set each drive to Cable Select? I've often thought of trying it, but it seems too easy.
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Its a bit obsolete now I think Simon.
Either Compaq or HP used to have theirs on that I believe but most manufacturers just stick to the normal master and slave settings now.
I think the new WD drive that I recently fitted in this PC had a jumper in place for use as a single master and had to be removed when I fitted a slave, or it was the other way round.
I even have a 60 gig that has a different set up to the usual single jumper, in some configurations it has 2 in and one is at right angles to the normal postion :-\
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"Cable select"
Means exactly what it say's on the tin. The jumpers don't determine which is Master and which is Slave, the cable does, dependent on the order you attach them to the drive.
I use cable select, as I have my setup copied on to a backup drive. So if C:drive fails, I can whip the side off the PC, swop the cable around, and the back up drive becomes C:Drive.
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Ermm exscuse me? ;D........can I just butt in for a second ;D reading between the lines here the 1st thing I need to try is a new IDE cable just to make sure its not that.
Next thing as I looked in the case earlier and just realised that the CD/RW is on the front end of the cable and the HD is in the middle, should it be the other way round ??
Heck its gone past midnight ........night all till this morning ;D
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The front end of the cable is the Master, and the middle is the Slave. The HD should be set as Master, and connected to the front end of the cable, and the CDRW set to Slave and connected to the middle. That's how it is on mine, anyhow. Due to the position of my drives, I had to twist the cable in a sort of figure of eight, to get the middle to the DVDRW and the 'front' to the HD.
Edit: This post is complete muppetry. I didn't get where I am today without mastering the art of incompetance! ;D ;D (See below)
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The position on the cable only matters when Cable Select is used.
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Bugger! Just when I thought I'd got something right! ::) So I can untwist mine and it will still work, Dack?
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Yep :)
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I'll get me coat... ;)
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Well I never knew that, Dack, re: slave, primary and cable connection.
Simon :pmsl: you brighten the most boring threads, I do miss ya when Pipex is down ;D
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here is my bios screen, had to take a picture with my "New" camera ;D
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Have you tried swopping one of the DVD drives with the Liteon CD-RW, so both DVD drives aint on the same cable. It's called the 1000 monkeys approach. They tried it to see if the monkeys could replicate the works of Shakespear, but they only managed to come up with some stuff by a bloke called Bacon. ;D
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Tony, Just tried all the different positions ;D..get your mind out of the gutter now :P.
XYZ
ZYX
YXZ and so on with all the different jumper settings correct for each cable >:( and all new cables.
Still sees it in the bios screen and not anywhere else........grrrrrrrr this is so frustrating :-[
Hook
PS I wonder if I should do a repair install to see if that finds it?
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Have you tried what I suggested, Hook?
Something else which might be worth a try is to 'uninstall' all the CD/DVD drives in Device Manager, then let Windows find them again. I think you said they are all present on your boot screen, so maybe it has simply failed to install the CDRW, and has got confused with the drive letters? This is only a blind guess, but I don't think it can do any harm.
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Yeah done all that Simon..ho hum >:(
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Have you udpated to the latest mobo drivers in case its struggling with the ide controllers for some reason ?
Sorry if I suggested it before and that you have already tried it but I am a bit pushed for time today and cant re read all the thread at the moment to check :)
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Just to drag this one back into life again.
After all this time I have actually cracked it ;D, after 12 forums countless shops etc etc.
I now have all 3 working, it was bloody easy in the end ;D
went into start/control panel/system/hardware/device manager/eide controllers/primary... in advance settings device 1 and typed in auto detect.
DVD Rom
DVD RW x4
Cd RW/Rom
Hookstar
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;D
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Mine did it automatically. Naa na na naa na! :wahh: ;D ;D
Glad you got it sorted in the end, Hook. :)
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Yeah but did you have ****** helping you >:(
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Can't think who you mean. (https://www.pc-pals.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.apax34.dsl.pipex.com%2Fsmileys%2Fwhistle.gif&hash=9e5e71f405724cdd90e1d3316f7c93e253e58822)
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have just burnt a disc in under 2 mins .... now thats more like it ;D
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Excellent news! :D I must admit, I haven't found as much use for mine as I thought I might, but at least it fills the case up! ;D
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yeah but when I burn with the DVD rom it only works at 16x but with the cd rom it working at 40x so I have the best of both worlds now with DVDs at 4x and Cds at 40x ;D
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Most 16 x DVD roms read CDs at 40 x Hooky, mine does ???
The older 4x and 8 x ones were slower but that has surprised me :(
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Sandra.. yes it reades at the higher speeds but it doesnt burn at the high speeds, on my Pioneer x4 DVD RW/CD RW will only Back up discs at 16x.
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I am with you now :)
I though it wasnt reading correctly, I just have my liteon 52 x CD writer and Pioneer 4 x DVD writer in and have found that to be ok for me as I heard that DVD to DVD recording on the fly wasnt a good idea :)